23-24 pre-season interview with Steve King

[kettdevil1]

The devils are lucky with this ownership group especially compared to previous owners, the bit about keeping and looking after the players was interesting to read

That was the bit that sprung out for me and that is what has been engrained in the DNA of the club over the last decade. I know others disagree but I love the fact that we have this sort of reputation and not just on a human level. Personally I would hate to be like Sheffield, where if players do not perform they are dismissed immediately, as firstly, I am not convinced that this works (see Sheffield's trophy cabinet in the last decade for evidence) and secondly, it creates huge turnover and a lack of continuity. Belfast have made this model work but they are the exception and I do wonder if this will continue if (when) Keefe and Thornton move on?

There is a balancing act, Nottingham are desperately trying to move away from the 'nice place to play' image but there is still a feeling that players do not improve there, whilst at Cardiff they tend to be either up to their previous level or they improve.

Each to their own but that part of the interview was a nice contrast to some of the horror stories you hear about previous iterations of the club and also other clubs

 

[E.D.S.]

That will always be a contentious debate - is it a winning mentality to operate that way or do we sacrifice a nice place to be over winning?

Personally I’d rather be able to attract the talent through the door in the first place and rely on the coaches to get the best out of them - which is probably where we struggled last year.

What I would question though… is that the right way to operate when it’s a coach that’s under performing and not a player?

Purely a philosophical debate. Not targeting anyone in particular.

 

[kettdevil1]

That will always be a contentious debate - is it a winning mentality to operate that way or do we sacrifice a nice place to be over winning?

Personally I’d rather be able to attract the talent through the door in the first place and rely on the coaches to get the best out of them - which is probably where we struggled last year.

What I would question though… is that the right way to operate when it’s a coach that’s under performing and not a player?

Purely a philosophical debate. Not targeting anyone in particular.

It's an interesting debate and I would argue that it can be possible to be both nice and successful. I agree with your point about the coaching issues last year but, in hindsight, I think leaving changes till the end of the season was probably right.

The problem with changing coaches twice in successive seasons is that this slowly becomes the norm (look at Sunderland's stint in the Premier League as a warning about the dangers of this) and creates a culture whereby the coach knows they will be replaced if results dip. In my experience this tends to create a culture whereby everyone is covering their arses rather than working collegiately. If you know you are not going to be fired for admitting mistakes then you can work together to fix them.

So I would argue you treat all employees the same although clearly that can create very frustrating situations

 

[lloyd_jeff]

It’s no different a career to any other, if both parties contribute to the ethos and no parties take advantage, both benefit. There is also employment laws etc etc, l don’t see how this debate is even a thing because it’s expected, no employer will employ anyone that can’t or isn’t performing without reasonable justification and continue that one way relationship and visa versa no employee would work for an employer. We can use Sheffield as an example, just remember, they don’t have recruitment issues, if they’ve got a bad reputation, nobody seems to have told the players who sign up or want too every year.

 

[kettdevil1]

I think the key point is Sheffield will have one trophy in (I make it) 7 years shortly which suggest that they do have problems. As I said, there are lots of different approaches but I wouldn't want to go that route

 

[lloyd_jeff]

I think the key point is Sheffield will have one trophy in (I make it) 7 years shortly which suggest that they do have problems. As I said, there are lots of different approaches but I wouldn't want to go that route

As EDS has said, it’s contentious, but l don’t see teams who are cutting underachieving players being adversely affected by that policy in their recruitment . We are a small club and that will cause high achieving players doubts, having the policy we do may well sway a person to sign. Having said that, there has to be a line, last two seasons, in my opinion got crossed, far too far to justify this as a defense.

 

[Leecalaway]

It’s no different a career to any other, if both parties contribute to the ethos and no parties take advantage, both benefit. There is also employment laws etc etc, l don’t see how this debate is even a thing because it’s expected, no employer will employ anyone that can’t or isn’t performing without reasonable justification and continue that one way relationship and visa versa no employee would work for an employer. We can use Sheffield as an example, just remember, they don’t have recruitment issues, if they’ve got a bad reputation, nobody seems to have told the players who sign up or want too every year.

I'm just extremely grateful to Steve King for giving his time to do this interview on here and to James for putting it together. I fully trust, with their vast experience in this field, our owners and Todd will do the best recruitment effort they possibly can. Our job is to be entertained and enjoy the hockey. 48 hours to go guys, who's excited?

 

[lloyd_jeff]

Im not sure my job is to be entertained, certainly expect my money to give me some though. But yes, fingers crossed we will get a decent game against Belfast.

 

[Leecalaway]

Im not sure my job is to be entertained, certainly expect my money to give me some though. But yes, fingers crossed we will get a decent game against Belfast.

I’ll re-word, the intent is for you to be entertained…..as you your money, you’ll get exactly what it says on your ticket…..a game of hockey. For me, that’s always entertaining, enjoying the moment and soaking up the atmosphere. We want to win, but we will always be presented with a good show from a team that wants to win.
The Belfast games are always my favorites, such hard fought battles. Hard to call this year but they’re going to be heading into the pre-season all guns blazing in prep for the CHL (and yes, I’ll be supporting Belfast in the CHL - representing the EIHL).
It’s so easy to look at the negatives and pick up on the little things that may bug you, but it’s far more fun focusing on the positives - a great season of hockey (which we all obviously love as we come back and forth here during the off-season), an outstanding and friendly atmosphere, and for me an escapism from day to day life….as I’ve said here before, the arena is my happy place haha.
Can’t wait to get back there ASAP.
And Jeff…..I really want to see you at the top of block 18 joining the dancing steward for Apache (Jump on it)…..go on, you know you want to

 

[lloyd_jeff]

I’ll re-word, the intent is for you to be entertained…..as you your money, you’ll get exactly what it says on your ticket…..a game of hockey. For me, that’s always entertaining, enjoying the moment and soaking up the atmosphere. We want to win, but we will always be presented with a good show from a team that wants to win.
The Belfast games are always my favorites, such hard fought battles. Hard to call this year but they’re going to be heading into the pre-season all guns blazing in prep for the CHL (and yes, I’ll be supporting Belfast in the CHL - representing the EIHL).
It’s so easy to look at the negatives and pick up on the little things that may bug you, but it’s far more fun focusing on the positives - a great season of hockey (which we all obviously love as we come back and forth here during the off-season), an outstanding and friendly atmosphere, and for me an escapism from day to day life….as I’ve said here before, the arena is my happy place haha.
Can’t wait to get back there ASAP.
And Jeff…..I really want to see you at the top of block 18 joining the dancing steward for Apache (Jump on it)…..go on, you know you want to

We live in hope, 2 yrs is disappointing, although over the 30 yrs I’ve bee going, it’s not unique and I’m sure not the last…..

 

[Finny]

Sticking with and looking after players was surely a big reason why we were the dominant team at the end of the last decade. We built up a good reputation as a club who looked after players and their families and didn’t make knee-jerk reactions. The hockey world is small and that reputation means a lot. If a player has bounced around teams the past couple of years and then get approached by Cardiff they might (and have) take the ‘lesser’ offer from Cardiff compared to a higher level league because they get that stability.

Under Lord it worked a treat. I don’t think we ever released anyone under Lord? Even when fans demanded he get rid of Layne Ulmer he stuck by him. And what a decision that turned out to be.
Of course, Lord benefited from lower expectations in those first two seasons and had time to fine tune his squad. He even spent several years tracking some players before finally signing them.

Of course the opposite technique is what Belfast are doing. And although they’ve been successful I think they’ve been very lucky.
In Keefe‘s first season they signed a total of 30 players. Won the CC but finished 5th and failed to make Playoff Weekend.
The second season they only signed 26. Won the CC again and pipped us to the league. Just.
But people forget how bad their 19-20 season then was. Just 8 players returned the following season IIRC. They nearly got knocked out of the CC at the group stage and then got knocked out by us without scoring a goal over two legs. When the season finished they were 4th but having played more games and in freefall were likely to finish 5th.
Covid actually worked out quite well for them. They were able to brush over the previous season like it never happened and when they did return had more stability than most other teams.
Even with coaching stability they still had to make change after change last season to the extent they made more signings than the league rules seemed to allow. For me Lord’s achievements are far more impressive than Keefe’s due to the fact that he won the league each time with pretty much the exact same team he started the season with.

 

[Mooney#16]

It’s interesting that if you watch the Giants documentary that Thornton is the one to makes the call on changes. Keefe takes plaudits but Thornton was the architect. Paul Dixon should have most definitely been coach of the year last season.

 

[moggy#9]

It’s interesting that if you watch the Giants documentary that Thornton is the one to makes the call on changes. Keefe takes plaudits but Thornton was the architect. Paul Dixon should have most definitely been coach of the year last season.

It's a valid point about coach of the year. IMO it's a lazy decision to given it to the coach of the most successful team. It should go to the coach who gets his team to exceed expectations. Keefe is a good coach, but had the advantage of the greatest resources. I'd agree about Dixon last year. In the end Guildford simply didn't have enough gas in the tank.

 

[kettdevil1]

It’s interesting that if you watch the Giants documentary that Thornton is the one to makes the call on changes. Keefe takes plaudits but Thornton was the architect. Paul Dixon should have most definitely been coach of the year last season.

I agree - absolutely no criticism of Keefe but as you say it is far more of a team effort (and the resources are there to back up their plans), whereas Dixon is very much the architect of a Flames team that definitely overperformed.