Time to move on.....!

Rempel16

Well-Known Member
#41
I thought that VancouverRule84 was actually encouraging shouting in support of the team in the game, as they allude to in the very first post... That contradicts the 'sit down, shut up and give me your money' attitude that you suggest.

So many on here and twitter have intimated over the last few weeks that they refuse to support Brent and Ragan (absolutely fine) but will support the 'team'..... Well consistent negativity at the games is not (in my view) supporting the team.

I want to stress here that I am in no way supportive of the current coaching set up or management (I don't think Brent is the answer) but I want my team to play well and secure results, and most importantly ENTERTAIN me, regardless of who is in charge.

I fully the expect the players to be professional and start making themselves accountable as I have already mentioned.

I also completely respect the view of those who are staunchly anti-Ragan and Pope, however, perhaps their next course of action should be to vote with their feet in order to initiate change and simply not turn up to games.

I try to attend games and enjoy the hockey for what it is... It's not my right to know the inner workings of the club that i care so much about.
 
Thread starter #42
I'm a back of bloke 2 man. Just putting a face to the post. No disadvantage...! May I ask why you don't push the button anymore as I remember you being involved with the club for quite a while...!

With regards to the facts this is my point we don't know!!!!!
 

Rempel16

Well-Known Member
#44
kettdevil1 said:
VancouverRule84 said:
Deference of opinion doesn't make you clueless making a statement without the facts that's a different story.....
So.....what are the facts?
Isn't that the point? No one knows the facts other than those directly involved.

And nobody has a right to know facts, other than those directly involved.

Everything else is simply opinion based on hearsay.
 

Paul Sullivan

Well-Known Member
#46
VancouverRule84 said:
May I ask why you don't push the button anymore as I remember you being involved with the club for quite a while...!
Sure, simple answer really. The Club decided to go in a different direction on match nights, hence the change in personnel.

In total I've been a Devil on some level for 24 years now. Got the grey hairs to prove it. You sit by Nargroth and Steve then, yeah?
 

Sheincar

Well-Known Member
#47
VancouverRule84 said:
I'm a back of bloke 2 man. Just putting a face to the post. No disadvantage...! May I ask why you don't push the button anymore as I remember you being involved with the club for quite a while...!

With regards to the facts this is my point we don't know!!!!!
If you are a back of Block 2 man you will know that we do shout & chant but last night I think we lost the will to live as it seems did the players. Was Ragan at the game last night or has he lost interest too?
 

kettdevil1

Well-Known Member
#48
Rempel16 said:
kettdevil1 said:
VancouverRule84 said:
Deference of opinion doesn't make you clueless making a statement without the facts that's a different story.....
So.....what are the facts?
Isn't that the point? No one knows the facts other than those directly involved.

And nobody has a right to know facts, other than those directly involved.

Everything else is simply opinion based on hearsay.
Yes, but......this may be a rather naive viewpoint but here goes......

I always believe that with any professional sports team, the one constant are the fans. Owners, players and even coaches come and go but the fans stay the same. Not sure who said it but someone in football once said that an owners only job is to make sure that they leave the club in a better state than it was before they arrived.

Hence..... I understand all the arguments about the owner putting money into the club but it is surely supporters right (and. I would say duty) to make sure that they act as a check on the owner. We don't know the full facts however, we do know that a large percentage of the fan base are being alienated, the team are performing poorly, several members of the Cardiff Devils have been treated badly and many people whose views I trust have voiced concerns.

These are the facts we know. So, we need to start asking questions.....very difficult questions at times but important questions to check that the club will be left in a better state than it previously was.

I will be driving up to 'ull on Saturday to cheer on the team and will continue to attend as many games as possible but to simply bury our heads in the sand and not ask questions is surely a dereliction of our duty......
 
#49
VancouverRule84 said:
I've never posted on here before however I constantly check and read to help me keep up to date with people's thoughts on the Devils. However lately things have been going on during the game where I feel I'd like to comment.

During the Clan game last night in the FINAL minute of the game (during a devils time out) the fans began shouting BRING BACK G, BRING BACK G. A couple of things puzzled me when hearing this.

1st - 2 nil down last minute of the game not the greatest time to hear this (support is what was needed)

2nd - what did the fans think G was going to do fly into the blue tent wearing his superman outfit and score two goals! (I think not)

I understand that things have gone on behind closed doors and G leaving or being made to walk could of been handled a little better but come on.

He coached us for I think 6-7 seasons and we haven't won anything in that time (apart from Guinness book of records thing). Big fan of G's but come on a change was needed!!!

Is Pope the right man for the job, umm maybe not. But all of you seem to forget its easy to blame the management but what about the players.....!!

The players should be held accountable as well. A lot of half arsed effort, until the final two minutes then we play, really, NOT GOOD ENOUGH DEVILS.

Back in the day that sort of attitude got you benched.

I don't say I know everything, and I don't say I'm always right. But what I will say is paying £17 + week after week to hear the fans moaning and shouting crappy comments is not what anyone wants.

I know we struggling and going though a massive dry spot on goals (and wins) but come on next games the steelers. Even if the players don't turn up, let's show them why the RED ARMY FANS AT HOME IN THE BLUE TENT ARE THE MOST FEARED FANS AROUND.

Block 2 + 3 let's get behind the team and sure the rest of the tent will follow. Maybe even lift the team enough to slam the steeler!!!!!!

PS. If you don't agree, I'd love to here your thoughts. However I'm not looking to fight anyone, remember these are my opinions not gospel....! Oh yer and stop being so horrible to the drummer on twitter. Without him all we would hear is the away fans.

Thanks for reading.......
Any post that puts forward a rational, reasoned viewpoint gets my vote in these polarized times :D

It seems that as a Devils fan you can't be balanced anymore. If you're not in the anti-Ragan/Pope camp you must be in the other and vice verser.

I do think the size of the anti-club argument is likely and inevitably exaggerated given that those with the strongest opinions are always the loudest and will be posting more often on here and twitter etc. We can get a little insular on here and forget that the majority of attendees last night (of which looked pretty healthy to me) probably no little about who the coach was or is, or really care too much about how the change came about. The 'hardcore' are a minority of the people that turn out on match nights.

That said, I also suspect there are a great many fans who are unhappy with the way the club is being run, but who are (from a purely hockey perspective) not unhappy to see Adams go. I'm certainly one of them. It's the kind of view point which is less polarized and therefore less likely to be posting furiously on here and twitter.

From a hockey point of view (and this is a hockey forum) Adams' results record as a player coach is reasonable to good given the club he coaches at. I would describe him as a safe pair of hands from a results standpoint.

His entertainment record is poor and this can't be underestimated imo. I stopped buying a season ticket because the hockey was so dire to watch.

The same traits of nobody going to net, nobody clearing the crease, soft teams, unfit teams not playing for 60 minutes, mentally questionable teams that can't quite get over the line, an unwillingness to enter the European market (with the added bonus of getting players in quickly), little alternative to dump and chase when it's not working. These were all flaws under Adams that seem to have been forgotten. Remember, there was thread on here that had a decent support not long before the sacking calling for him to go.

Of course, there were a lot of positives to Adams' coaching, but I'm just trying to provide some balance in relation to the general theme on here :)

It feels a little like people are reacting when a lead singer dies young. Suddenly mediocrity is celebrated as greatness when it never was.

I think there is a clear line between how things have been dealt with at the club (info fans shouldn't be privy to anyway) and Adams' record as coach, but it seems many are mixing the two up.

I'm not saying Pope is the answer, but I'm going to judge the on ice situation from a hockey point of view and nothing more. The start has not been good, but I can see 'green shoots' of recovery as it were.

The reality is the team is not playing like a team. The effort is there, but the confidence, fitness and quality is not at the moment. To compound the problems, individuals are making mistakes. For example...we'd have won that game if Blight had converted those sitters.

The team has it within them to improve and seems that maybe it's a couple of wins (and players) away from a few more wins. I liked Pope's comments post game. They should benefit the dressing room. I hope to see the team progress as they can. Ultimately, they're the ones with the power to do so :)
 
#50
kettdevil1 said:
Rempel16 said:
kettdevil1 said:
[
Isn't that the point? No one knows the facts other than those directly involved.

And nobody has a right to know facts, other than those directly involved.

Everything else is simply opinion based on hearsay.
Yes, but......this may be a rather naive viewpoint but here goes......

I always believe that with any professional sports team, the one constant are the fans. Owners, players and even coaches come and go but the fans stay the same. Not sure who said it but someone in football once said that an owners only job is to make sure that they leave the club in a better state than it was before they arrived.

Hence..... I understand all the arguments about the owner putting money into the club but it is surely supporters right (and. I would say duty) to make sure that they act as a check on the owner. We don't know the full facts however, we do know that a large percentage of the fan base are being alienated, the team are performing poorly, several members of the Cardiff Devils have been treated badly and many people whose views I trust have voiced concerns.

These are the facts we know. So, we need to start asking questions.....very difficult questions at times but important questions to check that the club will be left in a better state than it previously was.

I will be driving up to 'ull on Saturday to cheer on the team and will continue to attend as many games as possible but to simply bury our heads in the sand and not ask questions is surely a dereliction of our duty......
Excellent post, a bit like 'It is every patriots duty to protect his country from the government '
 
#51
I didn't see Ragan until the end of the game, but he was at the back of block 6 when the We Want G chant went up.

As for the players needing to turn it round, they're being coached in the week. I presume Brent is giving them a gameplan, if that's not working should they ignore the coach or persevere with instructions they know to be flawed? Given their coach is also the MD who has gassed 4 players in 3 months I wouldn't blame them for following instructions for job security.
 

Foxy

Well-Known Member
#52
VancouverRule84 said:
Thank you foxy, are you. These are the reasons why I joined the infantry and not the signal...! Lol.
Well i always say a woman could do a better job than a man but i think that we'd need another topic started for that one :D
 

James

Administrator
#53
Foxy said:
VancouverRule84 said:
Thank you foxy, are you. These are the reasons why I joined the infantry and not the signal...! Lol.
Well i always say a woman could do a better job than a man but i think that we'd need another topic started for that one :D
Bring back Marini :)
 

Rempel16

Well-Known Member
#54
Thanks for the reply Kettdevil1,

When you put it like that I completely see where you are coming from, and respect that you clearly have access to people 'in the know' who you trust.

I also completely agree that questions need to be asked, but constant negativity on a match night is energy that could be better used actually supporting the team on the ice. There is a time and place for those questions to be asked, and, for chants of 'we want G' and dare i say that the final minute when we are chasing a 2-0 deficit with a 6 on 3 pp and using a time out isn't it.

The negativity that was around the arena last night has perhaps had it's desired effect. I am seriously considering whether i should bother turning up to games anymore, and that should be a hockey-related decision, not an off-ice decision.

For the past few seasons (post-Weller) I have beeen disillusioned by the on-ice product - the hockey has been stale, with too much dump and no chase, and no heart/pride from many of the players. However, the enjoyment of the night out with friends remained a big draw....
Unfortunately, with all the negativity that draw is fading fast.
 
#55
bluedevil said:
I didn't see Ragan until the end of the game, but he was at the back of block 6 when the We Want G chant went up.

As for the players needing to turn it round, they're being coached in the week. I presume Brent is giving them a gameplan, if that's not working should they ignore the coach or persevere with instructions they know to be flawed? Given their coach is also the MD who has gassed 4 players in 3 months I wouldn't blame them for following instructions for job security.

The title of this thread says it all, It is time to move on, Time to move on from idiotic management decisions, baffling coaching decisions and even more baffling press releases. Time not to be seen as an organisation of no or low integrity these things are going to take a long time to leave memories and cause so many recruiting difficulties which will hinder the club getting back to where we were 3 years ago let alone the heady glory days.

I believe the current managment have passed the point of no return, not sure how they will progress forward. Maybe a 'Brian Candy' style owner? This would probably only work if PR had a total hands off role in the organisation organisation ( Can't see that happening )
 

steve

Active Member
#58
This is getting really dull now. Let's be honest - the inferno is being hijacked on a daily basis at present by a coordinated campaign aimed at bringing PR down. I would genuinely love to join you - i've wanted him out since he appropriated all that ST money in the knowledge that the business wouldn't see the new season, but the way you're going about it is quite frankly ruining he forum. No once can post anything without coordinated cluster-posting cronies jumping on the bandwagon.

If you want you can have a saperate thread, you could all step out from the shadows and bask in the glory that there's a whole 5 people out there who give a shit.

And before the brent-lover brand gets stamped on my arse, i don't want brent to be coach, i think he is a divisive influence and will not benefit the club in the long term. That said, G had his chance and bored me to tears in recent years. The last time i saw a devils team show genuine grit, passion and be entertaining on a regular basis, BP was actually the coach. Whatever you think of him, we wouldn't have played like the pussies we have been in recent years.

We get it, you don't want PR - good luck to you, just stop going on about it.

Feel free to reply, but i'm not interested. Too busy.
 

Finny

Well-Known Member
#59
Errrr.... are you serious Steve?

A brand new poster comes on here and tells us all that everything is fine and we all need to get behind the team (where have I heard that before?) and you expect everyone to just agree?

I'm not sure if I'm being classed as one of the cluster-posting cronies, maybe one of the Militia, but the truth is I'm just a Devils fan. And I've been a Devils fan for 27 years, but I'm afraid that might be coming to the end.

I don't care who is the Devils owner. What I want is for the club to be run sensibly. You need only look on twitter or other forums to see that the decisions made this season so far by the management have turned us into a laughing stock.

I haven't seen such apathy amongst the Devils fanbase since 2001, and arguably it's worst than then. That wasn't just 5 people chanting "We Want G" on Sunday was it? It was several hundred.

If something is not done very soon I can see our attendances plummeting to record lows. Nobody wants that and that is why we are making our views public - so that the management can react before it is too late.
 

wildthing74

Well-Known Member
#60
Finny said:
Errrr.... are you serious Steve?

A brand new poster comes on here and tells us all that everything is fine and we all need to get behind the team (where have I heard that before?) and you expect everyone to just agree?

I'm not sure if I'm being classed as one of the cluster-posting cronies, maybe one of the Militia, but the truth is I'm just a Devils fan. And I've been a Devils fan for 27 years, but I'm afraid that might be coming to the end.

I don't care who is the Devils owner. What I want is for the club to be run sensibly. You need only look on twitter or other forums to see that the decisions made this season so far by the management have turned us into a laughing stock.

I haven't seen such apathy amongst the Devils fanbase since 2001, and arguably it's worst than then. That wasn't just 5 people chanting "We Want G" on Sunday was it? It was several hundred.

If something is not done very soon I can see our attendances plummeting to record lows. Nobody wants that and that is why we are making our views public - so that the management can react before it is too late.
Bang on the money sir!
 
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